Bob Bye, the 2004 Jamboree Chief is looking for your input in helping decide how to proceed with the Jamboree in 2008. A small "task group" will be set up to think about the "how, why, where and when".

Let us know your thoughts - first, should we have a Jamboree in 2008? What should the format be? Where should it be held? How big should it be? If you have any comments on these, or any other aspect of how we can make sure the 2008 Jamboree [if we have one] is as good or better than EIJ'04, then post here or just get in touch and I'll collate your comments and pass them on.

Thanks

matt

activities.staff@essexscouts.org.uk

Jambo in 2008 is a must!! as far as I know, all the thousands of people enjoyed it!! I think something similar with a dfifferent theme would be fine! The site of this years event was also perfect for the event!

Essex jamboree 2000 was my first jamboree, and it was brilliant. This time i was on staff and the jamboree was better still. Just keep more of the same i think!

I think the location of the site has been good, close to harwich port and stansted so easy to get to for the internationals! and also not too bad a drive from anywhere else in the uk.

However there are some major issues that i feel need to be adddressed for next time with some though, being - recycling ( you did a great job of getting this organised Matt, but i think we need more) and also - Electricity - We use alot of it, and those generators used tons of diesel (literally) someone did work it out, and the results were quite alarming. Maybe we can somehow drain the national grid for a couple of weeks!

But apart from that everything else was very good, and big congrats to the webteam, as i found the site and forums very useful close to the event.

would it not be better to hand out the goody bags at the end of jamboree?

this would cut down on waste and recycling during jamboree. enable scouts and guides to keep their tents tidier. it may also help the organisers to gain more volunteers to bag pack and make it easier to store items whilst jamboree is happening.

whilst the drink bottles were a great idea our scouts seemed unable to bring themselves to use them once they'd been put down and possibly mixed up with someone elses!

with regard to electricity consumption may it be an idea to contact local universities engineering departments or british petroleum, indeed anyone researching alternative power sources to see if they can come up with any solutions to reduce power consumption by the next jamboree, even perhaps using us as a test centre. solar power for the showers may be a good starter.

The show must go on as they say, so the jamboree in 2008 is a must have. This year was my first and i thought it worked really well, everybody seemed to have fun, so keeping most of it the same would work fine. As with everything there has to be minor adjustments but this only makes things better.

In 2008, i think that there should be more activities that explorer scouts and rangers would enjoy. This would make the whole site inclusive and if the subcamps and the paths through the subcamps are set out better so that everybody can interact with other troops it would have an even greater atmosphere.

Another idea is that, if the jamboree gets bigger again and more popular the evening ents will need either more of a bigger area. Maybe in 2008 have another tent which does recent music, like pop. So then there is a tent for dance, pop and live music, plus the outside stage. The dance tent got really hot and cramped most nights, so maybe if the size was increased more people would want to join in.

The site should stay the same as it was big enough and in a convinient place for most people to get to, including the international people. Once the word gets about for Essex jamboree the numbers will start to increase even more and maybe then a new site may need to be considered, however there are a lot of memories for a lot of people based there now. If a good theme can be thought of an organised well, like this years one, there is no reason for the jamboree in 2008 not to be better than this years.

custard

As part of the Site Services Electrician's team, I can comment on the generator issue.

The power consumption for the site was in excess of 1 MegaWatt, and that's proably more of the the whole village is using ! We'd need an extension to the National Grid, and a on-site substation - which would obviously be very expensive.

Solar power is a nice idea, but to get that sort of power, you'd be talking of a solar array the size of the market square !

So generators are the only solution......

The site at Kirby does have its disadvantages, i.e. local services are not totally suitable for the large 'town' we've got at the Jamboree, such as the only way we've got enough water available on demand is via a clever solution by the plumbing team, as the local water pressure isn't enough.

The advantages are that it is possible to make the event bigger by expanding into the surrounding fields, as most of these are owned by the same farmer, and, as previously mentioned, its location.

I won't deny that other venues are being considered, but don't think it would be ethical to post these on this public forum.

Ryan

Essex Jamboree 2008 cor dosn't that sound along way away there has got to be another one as myself and My explorers enjoyed ourselfs alot

Disadvantages ok from a particpent point of view, not many i can think of other than not enough showers!!!!! other than that it was great fun was had by all and i think the site is perfect it. Ok yes for us it was a 3 hour drive but well worth it, only annoying thing was the roads leading in to it could not handle the amount of traffic as it took us 2 hours to do 100 miles then when we got close it took an hour to do 10 miles which was kinda a nuiscence but other than that it was worth the wait.

Myself having been to many Jamborees this has got to be the best so far, the Event was well organised the activites were arranged so all got to do what they wanted!!

I can warn you know if sorry not if when 2008 comes round BEDFORD will be at Essex Jam causing as much hassle as we did this year!!!

Hey hoooo

I think EIJ 2008 should definately go ahead...
Why?
Because there are gonna be a fair few folk that aren't going to be able to attended either eurojam in 2005, or the world jamboree in 2007 - so in my warped lil world of theories it'd be good to go ahead with it to keep Essex Scouting/Guiding on the map..
Where?
Personnally I'm a fan of Devereaux Farm.. as others have said its an ideal location with easy access for both national and international participants...
When?
Well the last two have been roughly the same time of year.. why change it?! We've been (pretty much) lucky with the weather (ok we'll ignore the slippey slidey muddy openin ceremony of 2000 for now!), so why tempt fate changing it...
How?
(Hmmm this is where i'll probably come back with more ideas cos i can't think of many off the top of my head...)
Ok, at a risk of sounding unpopular.. maybe we should consider 'down-sizing' slightly, i know i'm not alone in thinking that the sites where a tad over crowded this time in comparison with 2000... or maybe it was just the way that the pitches where set out... (i'll try and explain this one now.. um in 2000 all pitches where facing into the centre of each sub-camp arena/ football pitch.. this time some participants where sandwiched between others, having to cut across other pitches to gain access to their own - hope that makes sense ) anyways the point i'm trying to make is that in 2000 it just felt more friendly and i guess 'community-like' (we even dropped our 'fence' and ended up adopting our irish lads having a joint camp (oh the memories, but i digress...) - the other arguement for this is that the '20 foot rule" between tentage was out the window, which did rise some concerns with 'fire-saftey'...
Mite also be an idea to reconsider the age sections as regards to evening ents... Maybe 16+'s could be aloud into the equivilant of 'zorbas'... then u have to show security passes again at the bar..?! Oh and maybe it shouldn't be in the middle of the 'staff camp site' either... not fair to keep those who have to be up early, up late with all the random raudy shenanagens!!!
Have to agree with 39thepping... Maybe the *gift bags* should be distributed to each contingents leader at the end of the jamboree?! - I have to admit i found it really annoying walkin around the site seeing bits of the gifts bags strewn all over the place! (maybe cos i read on the forums how much work went into making them up?! anyways..) We as a unit didn't actually give out our gift bags until the end of the jamboree!!! (We provided a bottle of water, which they could re-use so nobody got dehydrated...) So instead of the guides taken home a taty carier bag with wrinkeled up bits of paper and thousands of dead hover flies... they were presentd with their gift bag + contents / full set of hermes heralds / full set of torchlights, oh and the hover flies... we did the same kind of thing at 2000 and found it works...

Ok thats me done (for now! ) - hope i've been of some use...

Fairy

The road situation is always going to be a hassle where ever you hold
the event. Fortunately the only places to erect a temporary town are
in green belt areas which tend to be very rural.

Firstly just to add to Ryans response in regard to electricity. The
only feasible way to power the Jamboree site is by means of
generators. It would cost more money than the jamboree turns over to
have a large enough electrical supply taped off the local electricity
board supply.

The generators we use are as environmentally friendly as they are
going to get I am afraid. If you are looking down the line of energy
conservation, environmental issues etc. We can cut back on the amount
of showers used on site as these create a lot of water that has to be
removed from site and then cleaned plus the amount of diesel used to
power them. Also if everyone helped a little to cut down the amount
of waste water, power etc. Turn the light off in the shower when you
have finished, don't spend ages in the shower, wash instead of
showering.

The system they use at Norjam for showers which seemed to work well was they classed it as a ticketed activity you could only use one if you had a ticket. This will stop people having two a day.

An idea which might be a logistical nightmare could be a bunch of local pick up points for y.p's so you havn't got one car dropping off one y.p.

Staff catering does need to be sorted. The guys did a brilliant job but it needs to be more flexible for the staff members who are working shifts.

Myself and alot of my team only got one meal aday through staff catering as we were asleep during breakfast and lunch (I lost 10lbs) fast food were doing their best to suppliment our food intake. I also understand that the teams who had packed lunchs weren't that impressed either.

At the end of the day there is a thousand staff members doing there part to support the y.p's. If their lives can be made easier it will defantly effect their input with the yp.

A seperate camping area for people who we know are going to be noisy during the night or even just a place they can go were we can keep an eye but not inforce to much preasure on them as they are not disturbing others who are sleeping. Such as a night marquee or something.

This is all i will add for now but ill have a decent think later.

The only thing i found slighty disapointing this time round, was the evening entertainment (or lack of it!) for participants aged about 16+. I went as a young leader with my Guide unit, and having spent all day with the guides didn't want to spend all evening with them too! The only entertainment for particpants of around my age group was the same entertainment as my 11 year old guides! I was told various reasons for the spilt colours of passes, but this didnt make it anymore entertainting! There needed to be something for older partcipants!

But part from that it was great!

Now, is it right to me to reply to my own questions??? hmm... well, I'm going to anyway.

Where: Deverux Farm is a nice place; however, other sites should be considered. I think we wouldn't want any more people than we had this time around at that site. I wonder if there is anywhere else more cost effictive? Any ideas people? Would somewhere with permanent infrastructure be better? (just to clarify - no decision has been taken on where the jamboree will be held, and nor will it be until the "task group" is formed!)

Why: Because we want to continue the tradition of fantastic Essex Jamborees every four years! I agree with the comments above - many people will miss out on 2007 so by providing a fantastic event in 2008 they won't miss out on the jamboree experience altogether.

How: Hmm - the difficult one. A good theme. Capped numbers. I get the feeling that people want a seperate senior subcamp; not sure if I agree with this, but certainly it needs to be considered. "round pegs, round holes" (leaders will understand that one). Fab PR like this year.

more comments please....

matt

p.s. comments on recycling and goody bags duely noted. Don't expect goody bags again though... this may have been a one-off!

IMHO the reason for the great success of EIJ2004 was due to the huge effort put in by the Executive Commitee and Media depts. They gave support and promoted the event like no other before it and the numbers attending gave us the finances to put on a more professional and well run event than ever before. Would a downsized event have the same support and facilities with a lower overall budget?? thats up for discussion.

What I would say is I think the Devereux site can't take any more than the numbers we had. The Open day was something else as well, perhaps a "pre booked only" open day would be better next time. Plus as mentioned elsewhere the local road network isn't really ideal for an event with so many people coming on site at one time.

The lay out of the sites (sub camps) was up to the individual sub camp teams but obviously with more people, laying out with enough space was always going to be difficult, although (and this isn't a critisism , just a comment) some did have very large communal areas while others did not.

P

if we could hire out more fields at devreux farm i think it would be great, we could have a slight increase in numbers with a bigger increase in space.

As regards to 16+ ents, zorbas was 16+ apart from the bar bit wasnt it?
With the other ents, i feel personally that it was just right this year, in other jamborees i have been to there has been too little to do, so oyu get bored, and with others ther has been too much going on in the evenings, so all the places are half empty and not really that sociable.

I think staff catering needs to be a lot more centeral aswell, as many peopl i know didnt actually have time to get all the way over there and sit down and have a meal, even though they paid for it, they were working that hard!! Maybe put it in one corner of the market square, with a walk-thru area, where you can just quickly pick up you food and go back to work!

Also, staff ents should be neare the market square aswell, so that people who want a quiet night can camp well away from all the noise.

Maybe a 'shower ticket' would stop people having 2 showers a day, i was there two weeks and i had about 5 showers in total so i might have smelt a bit, but thats part of camping. It was worse at 2000.

And what about a huge hamster wheel to generate elctricity, we could keep it going all week with the number of people on site!!!

It's great to see so much enthusiastic comment about the Jamboree.

One of the reasons for asking if 2008 is right is because the Guide Region are holding a large camp that year.

This therefore may affect the number of adults available to act as staff and attend as leaders. Especially from the Girl Guiding UK.

Would 2009 be a problem? Should it be in 2008 anyway?

I reiterate Matt's statement that no decisions have been made. My fellow County Commissioners and I want to see what the Task Force recommends before we make any decision about where, when, and how.

If you want to be part of the task force then please shout at either Matt, Bob or even me.

Keep the comments coming.

Cheers

Rob

Having been to about 8 jamborees I found very little fault with the Jambo,

As it was held on farmers field sit seemed to run well. the worst one I went to was cam jam 2002 where we all got flooded out and that was at a show ground with hard roads I understand the next cam jam will be at a race course.

Keep up the good work.

Now then, I know that I have already replied to this topic, but I've been going through some of the feedback from the website and making nice colourful graphs and pie charts, and some of the comments make for interesting reading.

Many comments have stimulated me to think about what a Jamboree is all about. Would it be better if we went "back-to-basics"? Do we realy need squillions of pounds worth of entertainments and activities equipment? Should we be focussing on more traditional Scout and Guide activities?

Are discos every night what you want, or perhaps something a bit different? I know we had lots of discussions about campfires before the Jamboree, but it's something that was repeatedly mentioned in the feedback... (why do we love 'em so?!?!) Would we be able to have more traditional fires if we scaled back the Jamboree and reduced numbers? Would this be acceptable? What do you think?

Some comments said the Jamboree should last for longer - 10 days, for example; or perhaps we shuold have them every two years (nooooooo!!!!)... Your thoughts?

Let people know that this topic exists as Bob and Rob (sounds like a comedy double act) would be very keen to hear all your ideas for the future of the Jamboree. Get your Scouting friends to take a look at this topic - they don't have to register to say what they think; they can email me direct on activities.staff@essexscouts.org.uk if they would prefer.

The Jamboree executive and Heads of Departments will be getting together at the end of October to fully debrief the Jamboree - this will provide a starting platform for the next Jamboree... make sure you have your say though - don't leave it up to them! Get invovled, get your voice heard and let's hear what you really think!

matt

I feel that the Essex Jamboree should not downsize, as so far it has always been the biggest and best jamboree i have been to.

As to discos every night, i think we might need to, as one of the reasons alot of people attend the jamborees is for the nightlife. The festical feel of the jamboree was great.
Maybe focus on the traditional activities aswell as the new ones, but deffinately not instead of.

Is the thing about campfires due to the numbers or the spacing between tents, if it is just the spacing between tents, then simply get more space.

I think the jamboree should last a weeks, the same as it does at the moment. I believe that one of the problems Eurojam is facing is lack of staff. I think this is not only due to the price, but to the fact that they have to take two weeks or more off work to attend. This is also ture with leaders. I think that if the jamboree was longer, then we would have a fall in numbers, with a lack of leaders and staff.
As to running them every two years, i dont think we should. My scout group does a round of the jamborees, (essex 00, then we did a normal camp @ buckmore 01, camjam 02, norjam 03, essex 04) etc. Also the organisation takes at least one year of peoples lives. I think asking the organisers to give up that much time is too much.

One other thing i would like to mention. The organisation for some of the activities, eg open day, there wasnt really much to do in the morning and with the free slot, not many leaaders realised what we could do.

Without the nightly discos, there was very little else to be doing in the evenings, on the other hand, there are very few alternative activities that could take place at night. Considering the number of people who were in there each evening, I think that discos on every night are essential.

With regards to the idea of going back to basics, on one hand, this could be a good idea as it will save costs and will bring back more of a scouting element to the event. On the other hand, as times change, scouting should as well. I haven;t heard anyone saying that they would have preferred say orienteering to Its a knockout or anything like that. Anyway... thats my few words, i'll go back to sleep until someone else says something I feel like responding to

surely to consider 2008, we need to know whether 2004 was a financial success.

In 2000 jamboree made a profit of £9000 following losses on the two previous events, (see essex accounts for 2000/1- the last web published accounts on our site!).

If the jamboree made a loss then the expensive items (which we need to be told about) must be looked at carefully, to allow us to consider whether the cost/reward ratio is acceptable.

If jamboree made a profit then it significantly opens up the options available to us, and the directions we can go in for the next one.

So did 2004 make a profit?

Regarding solar power for the next jamboree, my earlier post perhaps didn't make it clear that i was suggesting solar power for the heating of water for the showers only. Does that make it technologically more feasible/cost effective?

You will be pleased to hear that with some confidence I can say that the 2004 Jamboree made a profit. The final figures are yet to finalised.

However it is necessary to bare in mind that the final destination of that profit is the decision of the 3 Guide County Commissioners and myself.

However some of the materials used previously and in 2004 are now in need of replacement so I would personally support investment in equipmenat and materials for future Jamborees.

However, as yet nothing is set in stone, so watch this space.

Hope that helps

Regards

Rob

This was only my second EIJ as I missed 2000. I have to say I thought 2004 was *amazing*...
A few things I'd like to add to the discussion:

Age ranges/entertaiments for young leaders etc etc:
This is something that should really be sorted out for next time. From what I saw and heard there was a pretty big group of people who were kind of stuck in the inbetweeness of being half leader half participant. I think this is partly due to adjusting to the new age ranges in scouting and trying to keep them level with guiding. I agree it is a little unfair to not have entertainments for these people. However, the young leaders I spoke to were also spending their days on the activities with their y.p.s... so in some ways they were more participant than leader (waits for flames...).
I'm not trying to say that these leaders werent working as much/hard as any other stuff, just highlighting the diff sides to this story... one way or another this one needs some thought.

Staff Facilities
Firstly, Mt Olympus organisation could be tweaked a bit. Since there was such a broad range of people in terms of age, responsibilty at the jamboree etc it would have been a good idea to seperate the camping areas maybe. It wouldn't have to be too formal with divisions or anything, but just labelling 3 corners of the field as 'quiet/early risers', 'family/young children' and 'noisy network;)' would have sorted out a lot of issues people had with being kept awake when they had early starts, being woken early by crying babies after a long night at Zorbas etc...
Admittedly this wouldnt necessarily solve everything as shift patterns change etc but it would even need to be 'enforced' since it's all staff.

Staff catering: a big thanks to all the staff catering team. What ever complaints people have its no mean feat preparing tens of thousands of meals in a field.
That said, there were problems with timing, confusion, and a lot of people with special dietary reqs didnt seem to get a particularly meal a lot of the time. Also I have to say it would be nice if staff members would remember when dealing with other staff teams the reasons we're all here and the spirit of Scouting. Hearing someone say that, given all his years of experience in catering, if would not be possible for four members of our team (out of a total 1000) to eat at a different time to the rest was really quite disappointing.
As a friend of mine put it, 'The kids have been great, the only problems we've had have been the adults'. Of course we're all busy, tired, stressed etc but we're all in this for the same reasons, rite?

Entertainments
From what I saw ents was all gravy. Zorbas was a giggle, even if not my cuppa. It possibly would have been good to have another option in the evenings for YPs tho I can see that each additional 'thing' in the market square adds an extra *ton* of organisation/running/hassle.
Wrt 'back to basics' I don't think we're really that far from them. No-one ever said Scouting was just about camping, tying knots.... anyway we do this stuff, plus more. Moving with the times isn't an option, its a necessity. The big stage, vid screen etc were all mint IMO, and the atmosphere really was great, very 'festival-y' I agree, and I think thats great. All that said, campfires (though I really don't love the singing personally) are part of camping and if possible we really should have one. Would it be possible to have a relatively small fire in a seperate area, so everyone could go at least once over the course of the week?

Electricity/Energy/Site Services
Not commenting about MASH, you guys did a great job, always do (even if you lost you sense of humour and had trouble dealing with defeat ) but given the size of the event and the fact it's all about the thousands of YPs we should be constantly looking for ways to be more energy efficient/ecologically friendly etc etc, if nothing else then for the fact it saves money!
Maybe it would be worth trying to hunt out potential alternatives for electricity. It would be fantastic if, say, there were windpumps to supply even part of our energy. I should think there's plenty of wind, and it is possible that some large corporation might want to get involved, but if you don't ask, you don't get. In todays world I would hope there is at least something we can do to make ourselves more eco friendly - I was shocked to learn that recycling facilities weren't arranged as a matter of course!
As someone has pointed out, there is more to this than just switching our source of power. I think it would be good to encourage groups to help out saving energy. Given how sunny it was, I think a lot of people could have used those cool solar heated camping showers - avoid the queues, save some energy. I only saw one on the entire site though.
Maybe an activity could be to build a small windpump or solar powered something or other. This would probably tie in nicely to an activity like radio shack... either way I think we are lacking considerably in terms of environmental awareness. Not to say the recycling facilities weren't good to have, but there is definitely more that can be done. Especially since things like this become easier/more efficient with large numbers, and there *is* a lot of help from councils/govt if you look.

Time and length
I think a week is plenty. As a Scout after a week of camping I was wrecked, but contented. Any more is pushing the boundaries a bit and you end up with lots of overtired YPs (and adults!). I'm sure most staff, esp those there for longer periods, would agree.
As for a date for the next one, how big exactly is the big Guide event in 2008? I'd presume not quite 8,000 but if its approaching several thousands it might be worth considering a change of time.

thats all for now, sorry for the length, just like to express myself

simon

I thought the jamboree was great. The location was great. Our subcamp had plenty of room but some of the other subcamp seemed to be very squashed. Entertainment in the evening was good. I thought some of the 14 to 17 years may have felt a bit left out with the evening entertainment??

The water activities: Were they cancelled due to lack of instructors? One member of our group is a kayaking instructor and was told they had more than enough instructors so was not needed. ( I know one more would have solved the problem)

Having no showers on site wasn't a problem, as solar showers were suffient.

Cost was just right. And allowing leaders to go as participates with activities was a good idea. And a week was just the right amount of time.

When we arrived we were a bit confused as to where to go to the subcamp.
A camp fire (without the fire part) would have been good.

But it was great and should not be downsized.

Greetings you merry bunch of Jamboree goer's you,

It's good to see so much comment on the Jamboree.. This Task Group then? What we need is volunteers.

I see a small group of no more than half a dozen or so of mixed individuals i.e some Guide types and some Scout types. Not wishing to exclude the old; the bold; and the bald or the grey, but there must be some young people too.

If you are interested then please let either Bob Bye or myself know, My email address is cc@essexscouts.org.uk; Bob's is events@essexscouts.org.uk

Not everybody who volunteers will be able to join the Group so if you volunteer and are not chosen thank you but do not be upset I'm sure we will be able to use your talents at another time.

Keep smiling

Rob

I think the jamboree was really great!
There should be one in 2008, and I will diffently parcipate again.
I think it was really great that there was done so much for both parcipants and staff. I saw the DVD today, and my family were absolutely amazed of so many activities there were done for the parcipants. It's a lot better activities then I've ever seen on any Danish camp. I don't really have anything to complain about, except from that I wish there weren't so long time till the next jamboree!
Can't wait untill 2008!

was zorba's open to over 16's as we didnt no about that? and i agree ents for 16 + werent all that gr8!

fi x x x

Nope - Zorba's was open for over 18s and staff members over the age of 16 only.

m

That was one thing I didn't like, several members of our team understandably had to sleep on a subcamp but I think they should have been able to come to Zorbas as they were all 15

That's another matter entirely. Staff members should be 16 and over. Under 16s should have been Jamboree participants. If the age for entrance to Zorba's is reduced to 15, then the 14 year olds will moan, and so on...

m

Fair point i guess! Guesss the limit has to be made somewhere! 16 is better than 18 as far as I'm concerned!

Keep to every 4 years, its been so for decades.
Perhaps a site more central, say parkland near chelmsford

Essex Jam was really good, all of your girls ejoyed it loads!

I only have one problem with the camp - only 24 showers!!!

I am a Kayaker and a shower is important after being in the water!

I think more showers or a rota set up for water sports to have priority when those activites are happening!

Overall good camp!!

24 Showers was impressive, considering in Year 2000, there were NONE.

i think someone said make the showers a ticketed event, and make exception of water activitied etc,

not that i would know as i had to deliver the newspaper electronic versions to the printers every day which was a 5 minute walk from my house. i really do feel for these people, although i have had tap showers before, fun

Showers: This year we had showers! Great - better than any Jamboree before!

Most of the feedback (from the website, which I collated) said that showers were something that participants would pay more for. Is this the case? If a shower cost £1 for example, would people still utilise the facility?

I've always considered showers a luxury at camp; perhps this is no longer the case; and it is expected? What are your thoughts?

matt
www.euorjam.org.uk

I wouldnt say that showers are expected, it depends what the camp is and how long it is for. I would still say that they are a luxury, especially at jamboree because it is in the middle of the field.

I personally didnt use the showers there because i couldnt be bothered, i just had one when we went swimming and when we did watersports. That was because it doesnt really matter on camp, its that the true meaning of camping, getting dirty and muddy?? Most people dont bother or care about their aperance when on camp because everyone else is the same.

If I go on a weekend camp i dont look for showers, i think that because it is a week people like to shower more and as they were there they got used more. If they were not there people wouldnt mind as much and wouldnt think about it and just get on with what they were doing. When we have a week camp we usually try and fit swimming in so that everyone can muck around and get off site but also to have a good shower.

The jamboree was great for having showers but i dont think people would mind if they had to pay to use them because most places or other jamborees probably wouldnt have a shower there anyway.

Custard

-firstly i think showers as a ticketed event for the kids and then maybe a seperate block for adult leaders, maybe where you have to sign up so have a certain slot to use it. i would think most people would respect the system. - re. zorbas, it should be plus 16 but obvioulsy the bar would be a problem but seeing as there was a small entrance between the ent tent and the bar tent couldn't bouncery ppl be put there to check that passes were 18+ and also there should be a seperate colour pass for over 16's as nearly 18 yr olds did not want to be classed the same as 14yr olds. - i personally like deveraux farm, but maybe im a bit biased as i had a little input on choosing it so many years ago but then if a more suitable site has come into existance since then, it should be looked at. - personally i think although ideally each jamboree it would be nice to be bigger and better i do feel it is getting a little on the large size unless we can enlarge the camping area. although i like a social atmosphere campers being on top of each other it was a little claustraphobic. - re. the proposed guide camp in 2008 i wouldnt be that concerned, being a guider i wouldnt want to diss guiding but i know of at least two proposed essex county camps that have failed to take place because of lack of numbers, personally i think guides should work towards making the jamboree more of an equal event rather than trying to make it the competition. plus they knew the jamboree regularly takes place every four years and so they should be the ones willing to make way for the jamboree not the other way round. hopefully these comments help even though they are similar to others. victoria

Yeah i agree about the colour tags! I didn't like having the same colour as some of the guides that i was there to help!

Changing the coloured tag system would help me and the rest of the security team its very hard to stop under 16 smoking when they have the same coloured tags as the 16+.

I think in this day and age we should supply showers for hygiene purposes its hot its sweaty and a shower is alot easier than trying to wash in a sink.

I have said before about ticketed showers and still think they are the way forward with the participants.

ticketed showers would be very good and also i agree with a shower being there as its very nice to have a shower if ur fellin tired nearer to the end of jambo, it makes u feel refreshed and ready to go. i would pay for a shower. you hav to pay for a shower at buddens campsite in dorset. one there much more respected and two u get a decent shower as there getin the income to pay for them!

Maybe before you make any finite decisions on anything, you should see what other people are doing. For instance, see how they run the showers at EuroJam, see how they run the evening entertainment at NorJam, see where the staff sleep at CamJam ect. Not that I mean to say that the organising people don't know what their doing, but if somebody else seems to have the right idea, why not do it too.
I always thought one of the reasons people came to a Jamboree was that it was different from a normal camp. Its not all Knots, Lashings, Pioneering, Orienteering ect, they have lots of different activities entertainments ect and thats what I thought makes them unique. This is just my opinion but normally on a scout camp I never get a chance to see live concerts or go powerboating, we have to stick to the traditional stuff, which is good fun too I must admit, but it was nice to have a change.

Anyway I've gone on too long, I thought Essex Jamboree was fantastic, I wouldn't mind if it didn't change at all!